Comments on: Still Seeking an Exploded Tinderbox for Tiger http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger It's all spinning wheels and self-doubt until the first pot of coffee. Fri, 19 Mar 2010 00:06:39 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0-alpha By: Joe Mazz http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-8929 Joe Mazz Mon, 20 Mar 2006 09:38:28 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-8929 <p>What intruiging ideas you are discussing here! You have struck a chord with my own hesitation to dive head-first into Tinderbox (TB)--- the need to import (or re-enter) all my key note content into its own "information repository," which even then would be only loosly connected to all the rest of the "notes" in thousands of other files on my computer. Another big limitation is its inabiliy to link notes between TB documents.</p> <p>It appears that Spotlight+SpotMeta provide the GUI to assign arbitray searchable attributes for file content, and SmartFolders provide some of the key functionality of TB agents. And I suppose symlinks in the OS effectively duplicate the primary role of TB aliases (notes that can appear in any number of other locations in the hierarchy). But these still cover only portions of the functionality of Tinderbox.</p> <p>What would provide the visualization component of TB that represents files as glyphs (at least like TB map view's "boxes", if not something more flexible and graphically rich), and that enables users to interactively create hyperlinks between files by drawing lines between them? Has anyone here come across, or perhaps started developing, a tool that can simplify (graphically) creating hyperlinks between UNIX files? Under the hood, clearly such a GUI would be making and breaking extended attributes shared in common between selected sets of files in the HFS+ file system.</p> <p>A recent post at macrumors.com suggests our creative friends at Apple are perhaps already onto this idea (for Mac OS 10.5?): http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=156291&page=6</p> <blockquote> <p>From the rumors I'm hearing about the next version of Spotlight and the possibility of creating linked relationships between objects, it should be exciting times.</p> </blockquote> <p>How about the assignment of attributes to the hyperlinks between documents (another unique and powerful TB feature)?</p> <p>And what would represent the TB function of templates and agents for automated formatting of selected content for HTML or XML documents by combining information from various files ("notes")? I suppose this could be programmed/scripted in any number of ways, using say Python or even Automator or AppleScript. </p> <p>The possibilities truly are endless.</p> What intruiging ideas you are discussing here!
You have struck a chord with my own hesitation to dive head-first into
Tinderbox (TB)— the need to import (or re-enter) all my key note
content into its own “information repository,” which even then
would be only loosly connected to all the rest of the “notes”
in thousands of other files on my computer.
Another big limitation is its inabiliy to link notes
between TB documents.

It appears that Spotlight+SpotMeta provide the
GUI to assign arbitray searchable attributes for file content,
and SmartFolders provide some of the key functionality of TB agents.
And I suppose symlinks in the OS effectively duplicate the primary
role of TB aliases (notes that can appear in any number of other
locations in the hierarchy).
But these still cover only portions of the functionality of Tinderbox.

What would provide the visualization component of TB that
represents files as glyphs (at least like TB map view’s “boxes”,
if not something more flexible and graphically rich), and that
enables users to interactively create
hyperlinks between files by drawing lines between them?
Has anyone here come across, or perhaps started developing, a tool that
can simplify (graphically) creating hyperlinks between UNIX files?
Under the hood, clearly such a GUI would be making and breaking
extended attributes shared in common between selected sets of files
in the HFS+ file system.

A recent post at macrumors.com suggests our creative friends at Apple
are perhaps already onto this idea (for Mac OS 10.5?):
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=156291&page=6

From the rumors I’m hearing about the next version of Spotlight and
the possibility of creating linked relationships between objects,
it should be exciting times.

How about the assignment of attributes to the hyperlinks between
documents (another unique and powerful TB feature)?

And what would represent the TB function of templates and agents for
automated formatting of selected content for HTML or XML documents by
combining information from various files (“notes”)? I suppose this could
be programmed/scripted in any number of ways, using say Python or even
Automator or AppleScript.

The possibilities truly are endless.

]]> By: Dowd McAllister http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-3242 Dowd McAllister Fri, 23 Dec 2005 22:20:57 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-3242 <p>I've been looking for something very similar. I like Tinderbox's simplicity and power, but for a while now, I've thought the tool would be easier to implement in Smalltalk http://www.squeak.org/</p> <p>I'm just waiting around for Croquet http://www.opencroquet.org/ , honestly. Once that is released, I think the tool we're looking for would be almost trivial to build. (my ideal version of the tool includes network awareness and collaboration)</p> I’ve been looking for something very similar. I like Tinderbox’s simplicity and power, but for a while now, I’ve thought the tool would be easier to implement in Smalltalk http://www.squeak.org/

I’m just waiting around for Croquet http://www.opencroquet.org/ , honestly. Once that is released, I think the tool we’re looking for would be almost trivial to build. (my ideal version of the tool includes network awareness and collaboration)

]]> By: John Robert Cornell http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2790 John Robert Cornell Fri, 18 Nov 2005 17:52:30 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2790 <p>I've had the same thoughts about exploding Tinderbox for a while. Bruce Horn, one of the original members of the Mac team, is on to something similar: http://www.ingenuitysoftware.com/</p> I’ve had the same thoughts about exploding Tinderbox for a while. Bruce Horn, one of the original members of the Mac team, is on to something similar: http://www.ingenuitysoftware.com/

]]> By: John G Bell’s Blog » Blog Archive » http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2782 John G Bell’s Blog » Blog Archive » Wed, 16 Nov 2005 23:20:55 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2782 <p>[...] Via 43 Folders, “Les Orchard: Envisioning a Tiger/Tinderbox mashup” links to “Still Seeking an Exploded Tinderbox for Tiger » Archive » Blog » 0xDECAFBAD“: [...]</p> [...] Via 43 Folders, “Les Orchard: Envisioning a Tiger/Tinderbox mashup” links to “Still Seeking an Exploded Tinderbox for Tiger » Archive » Blog » 0xDECAFBAD“: [...]

]]> By: Les Orchard: Envisioning a Tiger/Tinderbox mashup | 43 Folders http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2779 Les Orchard: Envisioning a Tiger/Tinderbox mashup | 43 Folders Wed, 16 Nov 2005 19:14:10 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2779 <p>[...] Still Seeking an Exploded Tinderbox for Tiger » Archive » Blog » 0xDECAFBAD [...]</p> [...] Still Seeking an Exploded Tinderbox for Tiger » Archive » Blog » 0xDECAFBAD [...]

]]> By: PbType: PbLog: Tag the filesystem http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2764 PbType: PbLog: Tag the filesystem Wed, 09 Nov 2005 13:59:04 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2764 <p>[...] Interesting looking Spotlight modification. (via)   [...]</p> [...] Interesting looking Spotlight modification. (via)   [...]

]]> By: Lee Phillips http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2758 Lee Phillips Mon, 07 Nov 2005 15:06:19 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2758 <p>I have been thinking along these lines, too. A while back I outlined a little kluge that allows you to use external editors with Tinderbox in a fairly transparent way (click on the note and the editor for that note's type opens up). In this way of working the note contents are maintained as external files, and Tinderbox is used to show their relationships:</p> <p>http://lee-phillips.org/osx/tinderbox/tinderext/index.html</p> <p>Lately I've been thinking that I would like to write notes using templates (Cheetah, etc.) and store their attributes in a standard database, then have .dot files produced by a python program to visualize relationships. All open-source, and portable to any unix-style system. HTML export would almost come free, using one of python's many web frameworks. You lose Tinderbox's direct manipulation, but you escape from its "universe" (with its non-Cocoa crustiness).</p> I have been thinking along these lines, too. A while back I outlined a little kluge that allows you to use external editors with Tinderbox in a fairly transparent way (click on the note and the editor for that note’s type opens up). In this way of working the note contents are maintained as external files, and Tinderbox is used to show their relationships:

http://lee-phillips.org/osx/tinderbox/tinderext/index.html

Lately I’ve been thinking that I would like to write notes using templates (Cheetah, etc.) and store their attributes in a standard database, then have .dot files produced by a python program to visualize relationships. All open-source, and portable to any unix-style system. HTML export would almost come free, using one of python’s many web frameworks. You lose Tinderbox’s direct manipulation, but you escape from its “universe” (with its non-Cocoa crustiness).

]]> By: Robert Brook http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/still-seeking-an-exploded-tinderbox-for-tiger/comment-page-1#comment-2750 Robert Brook Fri, 04 Nov 2005 13:16:12 +0000 http://decafbad.com/blog/?p=763#comment-2750 <p>Much as I love Tinderbox, I just can't bring myself to completely trust it. The reasons? Similar to those mentioned below!</p> <p>http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/why-proprietary</p> <p>http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/why-microsoft</p> Much as I love Tinderbox, I just can’t bring myself to completely trust it. The reasons? Similar to those mentioned below!

http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/why-proprietary

http://decafbad.com/blog/2005/11/02/why-microsoft

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